As an antitheist I would like to see the end of all religion. I think it all does more harm than good. But I am a tolerant respecter of other people’s beliefs and views.
I want to live in a pluralist society. I like my life cosmopolitan. I enjoy the richness of the rubbing together of other cultures, ideas and views. I do not enjoy monocultures. I like variety.
I despise intolerance, hatred and indoctrination. I do not see how anyone can justify implanting religion in young impressionable minds. To me that is child abuse. Families and schools who deliberately indoctrinate children should be taken to court.
There are four issues that come to mind straight away when dealing with religion in society:
a. The right for an individual to believe whatever religion or belief they wish with the proviso that they do not indoctrinate or display intolerance to others. That is something worth fighting for. We do not have to believe in the same things in order to get along. We can disagree and argue. That’s OK. That is our right and freedom.
b. Religious/faith schools. I believe these should be banned. There is no place for indoctrinating children with religion. The effects of segregation can be seen in the terrorism we are now experiencing. Our schools should reflect our values – tolerance, freedom, equality, democracy and fairness. We do not need undemocratic, intolerant values being taught to our children. I believe in respect and integration. Our schools are a civilising environment.
c. Religion in schools. Britain is a secular country. We should teach about the different religions but not teach religion. Most of the British people do not believe in God. As a pluralist society with Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Sikhs, Rastas, Atheists, as well as Christians it is plain wrong to focus on one religion and exclude everyone else. We should have a daily assembly focussing on awe and wonder or a common moral or ethical issue. That would be inclusive and not divisive.
d. Religion in society – it has no place in the power structure and should not have a place in its institutions. We are not a Christian society and have no desire to go over to any other religion. Part of the problem at the moment is that people are reacting against the aggressive Islamification of Europe. We do not want a theocracy. We should not have ‘Thought for the day’ being a religious input. Atheists, humanists and antitheists deserve at least equal time. The humanist/atheist voice needs equal respect. We should have our own ‘Songs of Praise’!
Without these stories coiled into a dance there would just be these timeless all-encompassing parameters
I like stories, dance and timeless parameters. I like mystery, creativity and awe inspiring, mind boggling dimensions.
What I do not like is dogma, hatred and arrogance.
I’m not particularly fond of organised religion myself!
That’s good to hear. I think it is mainly all about power. I prefer human contact, tolerance and friendship.
I agree about the schools Opher, you know that. Even my own Boys went through it at their Junior school, David when he was small was encouraged by my mother to dress up as a Priest, she even rigged up a little altar for him etc, the arguments I had with her to no avail this was when David had died. The Boys both non believers, Jonathan is like you.
I am off now, not long washed up, did a full roast beef dinner, no one wanted dinner last night, they got it tonight! Thanks for the fun this afternoon, “Sleep Warm”.
And you Anna. Hope your eye’s better tomorrow.
My memories of religious instruction at secondary school aren’t particularly good. I had this nut job, also a music teacher, who loved to give you 4 of the belt if you nodded off or got caught chewing gum. I hated him and everything he stood for. I’m sure it must have dawned on him that nearly all these boys in his class were not remotely interested and he could have utilised this time on more productive subject matter. He was also the senior years career’s councillor. What a joke – a religious classical music teacher offering career guidance. I couldn’t write the script.
I really have had my fill of religious ethos and particularly with the people that promote it or somehow find a calling to follow it’s path. I had 2 friends at school who I can remember telling me that they were going to university to study Theology. I’m pretty sure I must have looked at them like they had 2-heads. Not surprisingly upon completion of this mickey mouse degree course, they had serious trouble getting decent jobs. They never did as far as I know. Why do universities still actively promote this nonsense as a career option. It’s fine if one wants to be a practising minister or an historian, but pretty useless for much else.
Another thing I noticed were quite a few people who changed their degree courses when Bob Dylan converted to Christianity, (albeit temporarily) to this Theology stuff. That’s a prime example of despite possession of the basic academic qualifications to gain entry to such an institution somebody can still be an absolute Cretin. Similar to those whom are wanton to smother themselves in scribbled cartoons (sorry, tattoos) to emulate their heroic heavy metal star etc. It’s beyond me. I always get a good laugh at Pete Townshend with his Meher Baba baloney, the Indian seer whom apparently didn’t utter a word for 40 years! What’s the attraction. And then I noticed a number of other music business luminaries were also followers – most of whom did not possess a single brain cell between them. Hard drugs really do some serious damage.
A couple of amusing anecdotes – I’ve got loads more from other countries I worked but they tend to reflect the more brutal side to religious ethos, so here’s 2 that always amused me.
I once worked in St Lucia (Caribbean island) where there’s a whole load of them fully immersed in 7th Day Adventist beliefs. Crikey, every sentence that they speak contains quotes from Moses. It’s a complete mind fuck with these people and impossible to work with (IMHO). As an example, I had one guy who was the wedding co-ordinator. He was only mid-20’s or so but you wouldn’t think so listening to him talk. Saturday is the most popular day for civil ceremonies in the hotel grounds (photos on the beach and all such nonsense) anyway this guy could never show up to actually co-ordinate on the given day because of his all day prayer commitments at his 7th Day church. This guy was completely un-promotable and would be doing this non-job for the rest of his days.
Once again I could not write the script.
Kenya – and the Roman Catholic church. The better educated lot with half decent jobs not only give away 10% of their pay but spend their one day off per week, Sunday, marching up and down the streets singing and screaming hosanna’s to the lord, over and above the 2 church services. Come Monday, back at work these guys are goosed and good for nothing. I once walked into the accounts department and all 8 of them were heads down on the desk wiped out like 5 year olds at primary one. I just left them to it as it would make little difference whether awake or asleep to their departments performance anyway.
This is in part why so much of the world is still so backward. It’s got nothing to do with climate, drought, economics, politics etc. It’s people’s beliefs that hold them back from their full potential.
I had dispensation to not do religious studies at school. I handed the bibles out and read Sci-fi quietly at the front. It was by mutual agreement.
I think the religious thing with rock stars is to do with wealth fame and adulation. They are brought up to think that when they achieve all that they will be happy. But they are still fucked up and empty. After the adrenalin of performance wears off they are left looking for something meaningful. They try religion. With Townsend the deaf, dumb Meher fitted the bill. I bet it even sparked a song or two!
The worst place I’ve been to for religion was Bali. They are nuts. Everything has an offering and the main production is religious statues. It’s all they seem to do. No wonder they’re so poor.
I was in one of these factories in Bali that produces these religious artifact silk screens for sale in the big department stores throughout Asia. About 350 women/girls operating hand/foot machines all crammed together in the most archaic conditions. It was Dickensian slave labour. I had the distinct feeling that they thought I was there to buy them – the workers, not the silk screens. A pretty awful scene. That’s Asia all over.
Yep. I’ve seen some sights that are hard to take in China and India. In China there was a huge silk factory with huge long troughs of boiling water to soften the cocoons. Thousands of girls were threading the cocoons on hooks to unravel them and constantly dipping their hands in the boiling water.
If these are just our own general observations, the scale of world oppression looms at such a magnitude as to make me feel at any rate that change is just so far off the radar. So many countries are centuries behind western standards.
I use the bus to pop up to the supermarket and this morning overheard a woman complain to her friend that the bus was over a minute late! How little some people appreciate what they’ve got at their finger tips.